Email this topic to a friend Printer-friendly version of this topic		Archived thread - Read only  Previous Topic | Next Topic
Home Conferences Migraine Discussion (Protected)
Original message

PWallar	Sep-17-01, 06:30 AM (CMT)
"Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
Hi Everyone.. I know I haven't been posting much lately, just trying to hang in here with the migraines and life in general. I've had a spell of migraines last week that left me in pain most of the week and I see today it's still here. AGH! I Have a question for those of you who have or who do take Percocet for pain releif. On Wednesday of last week my Dr. finally called in a perscription for Rixocet(generic) 5mg/325mg-20 pills.This is the Dr. who wanted me to tough it out-No meds. I guess he finally realized that I was in pain and the meds aren't working. Thank God. However, I was honest and told him I had been trying Vicodin and it didn't do anything but make me talkative and wide awake. I picked the perscription up on Wednesday evening and it's Monday and it's gone... I had to take them all! I'm not sure if the strength wasn't enough or what, but I had to take 3 of them at a time for releif of the pain. I tried one and then two and then three. I had to take them about every 6-8 hours to try to knock the headache. I had to take them this weekend as every morning I woke up with my head pounding intensly and had to go back to bed. Last evening I ran over to my neighbors house and she gave me three more because I felt one coming on. So, that's a total of 23 in 6 days. That's about 4 pills per day. I can tell you this on the positive side, It does help tremousdly with the pain. It really dulled it and I felt as if I could stop complaining about a "migraine" for a while, or I feel one coming on and so on.. You know what I mean. I do have an appointment tomorrow with one of my neurologists. I'm not sure if I should ask him to give me a perscription for these. This is not the Dr. who gave me the script last week or should I just wait till my appointment with my other neurologists on Friday and ask him for another perscription. The Dr. I am seeing tomorrow is the one who wanted to try me on the Vicodin for releif. The Dr. I will see on Friday is the one who wanted me to tough things out and then finally this week, gave me the script for Percocet. I don't know what to do. I sit here in pain this morning, I don't want to call and ask for more. I called my sister this morning because I knew she had some (she can't take them) and she said "no she didn't" and obvisoulsy it wasn't working if I have taken them already. I shouldn't take anymore she said.." Now I feel like I've absued this or something?? The problem is it did knocked the pain out for a while, just didn't seem to last that long. I guess that's not a problem, but in some peoples eyes it is. I am wrong here? Was I taking too much or does anyone see what I am saying?? Taking this on Thursday was the only way I was able to stay at work. If I hadn't I would have been at home in bed missing work again. What do I do.. Anyone with advice?? PLEASE!!
	Top

RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., Richard, Sep-17-01, (1) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., PWallar, Sep-17-01, (2) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., Jenny, Sep-17-01, (3) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., Christa, Sep-17-01, (4) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., Christa, Sep-17-01, (5) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., PWallar, Sep-17-01, (6) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., Christa, Sep-17-01, (7) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., Jenny, Sep-17-01, (8) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., PWallar, Sep-17-01, (9) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., heavyhead, Sep-18-01, (10) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., Christa, Sep-18-01, (11) RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your ..., mishkyn, Sep-18-01, (12)

Lobby | Topics | Previous Topic | Next Topic

Messages in this topic

Richard	Sep-17-01, 07:03 AM (CMT)
1. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
I was first prescribed Percocet in the same strength as you in September of 2000. The purpose of the drug was to stop the pain of all headache and to stabilize me. The prescription was from the director of pain management at a major San Francisco hospital in consultation with my primary physician. The pain manager is also a neuorologist. I was very much in a place like I have heard you describe for yourself ... that end of the rope kind of place. I was prescribed 1 or 2 every four hours around the clock. That was a maximum of 12 pills a day, or 84 a week. I was told NEVER to take more than 3 at a time for fear of liver catastrophe. The "325" ingrediant (Tylenol stuff?) is toxic at the 1000 mg+ level for my body weight (200 lbs). I was told that it is critical to stay ahead of the pain. This means that if I wait until I just can't stand the pain to take the Percocet, then the Percocet won't work as well - hardly at all for me. If I stay ahead of the pain, take a pill at the first onset of pain, then it works and works well. I kept to the 1 pill evry four hours (skippng a dose for 8 hours of sleep evenutally) from September to December 2000. I am now taking 1 to 3 pills at the initial onset of a headache I believe will be a 7 to 9 level episode of headache (once a week or so). I have found that I experience severe 10+ rebounds if I don't taper myself off whenever I use Percocet. If I take 2 pills at 10 AM the headache will not be painful. but I then take 1 pill at 2 PM and 1/2 pill at 6 PM and 10 PM and go to sleep. I taper down by 1 or 1/2 pill every four hours until I sleep. Percocet makes sleep more difficult for me too. I asked why the 5 mg of oxycontin was attached to 325 mg of the "Tylenol" stuff. My pain manager told me that there were two reasons. (1) it prevented the possibility of crushing the pill and using a needle to inject the drug and get high. (2) In many studies the experts found that the pain relief was significantly increased with the addition of the "Tylenol" ingrediant. Impossible abuse and better pain relief - works for me! My pain manager told me that increased tolerance and less effective pain relief comes from waiting too long to take the Percocet and from not taking enough. tolerance is a function of "not enough" instead fo "too much." That's what I remember about my consultations with my neuro-pain-manager this morning on the subject of Percocet. I was EXTREMELY fortunate that by the time I got to see Wayne (pain manager) there was no more argument on the nature of my migraines. We agreed that regardless of what anyone else says, last September mine were daily and often lasted all day. Hang In There! Richard
	Top

	PWallar	Sep-17-01, 07:37 AM (CMT)
	2. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	Richard, Do you think I was being un-reasonable for this use. It sounds like I was using it correctly, I just ran out?? 20 isn't very many. I just feel as if my sister is saying I was abusing it and so on. Now I fear what the Dr. will say. I just found out my neurologists is in Ireland stuck because of the airplanes and they moved my appointment to Wed. I'm afraid of this pain.. Really. I can't get into my other Dr. until Friday morning.. What to do?? I don't want to lose the trust of any of these Dr.'s that's for sure. Do you think I was using wrong??
		Top

	Jenny	Sep-17-01, 11:58 AM (CMT)
	3. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	Paula, I've never taken Percocet, but a script for 20 painkillers to a migaine sufferer is like a handful of M&Ms. He may not have wanted to write a large prescription until you determined whether or not they helped. DO NOT let your sister or anyone else make you feel like you've abused the drug. You can't get addicted to Percocet in a week. In fact, you can't get addicted to a drug if it's affecting the pain receptors in your body. The addiction occurs when you take it when you aren't in pain. (Mental addiction occurs a whole lot faster than physical addiction.) You CAN get rebounds, but you can avoid those if you're careful, like Richard has pointed out. If I were you, considering you've got days before you can see a doctor, I'd call the one who wrote the Vicodin script and ask if he could try you on Percocet, since the Vicodin didn't help and since you're in so much pain, then you can talk it over with him when you see him on Fri. I'm wondering why you have two neurologists, though. That's a red flag to doctors and if they think you're seeing someone else for headaches besides just them, they'll think you're drug-seeking. I'd either make sure I never mention that you're seeing another, or I'd pick the one who is most sympathetic and stick with just one. The one who wanted you to stick it out without meds sounds like the loser to me. Good luck, and again, don't feel like you've abused the Percocet. The fact that you're concerned is a good sign that you'll be careful when you take it.
		Top

	Christa	Sep-17-01, 12:07 PM (CMT)
	4. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	If you don't think that you are abusing it then that should make you feel better all on its own. How your doctor feels is another story. We all know how most doctors feel about daily long term opiate therapy. Most won't do it, and will cut you off cold if they suspect you are doing it. Bottom line, if you are truly using these meds for REAL pain then NO you are not abusing, you are medicating. The important part is to do this under a doctors care because there will be a time when you can't "run to the neighbors" or call your sister to score some more. As you have found out with your sisters reaction to being asked. The fact that you have had to do that signals a problem. Either you are undermedicated or there is an abuse issue. I am NOT EVER one to discount anyone's pain so I say you need to find a doctor that is willing to properly medicate you.
		Top

	Christa	Sep-17-01, 12:14 PM (CMT)
	5. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	Jenny's advice was very good as was Richard's. The one thing I did want to mention is Jenny had a very good point about seeing (and getting meds) from more than one Dr. That does raise red flags, especially since Percocet is a schedule II narcotic, that is much more tightly controlled. If you are getting scripts for percocet from more than one dr. that could be considered "felony doctor shopping" depending on the state you live in. Not to mention it frightens most drs. into dropping you.
		Top

PWallar	Sep-17-01, 12:35 PM (CMT)
6. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
I realize what everyone is saying. I did the appropiate things I was supposed to do and called my Dr. to see if he would call in more or I could come in and see him. This is the Dr. who told me not to take anything but finally called in the Percocet. He told the nurse to tell me that his schedule was completely full and the only time he could see me was on Friday at my scheduled time. I asked what they do in case of emergency? She just said "I don't know?" This is what he told me to tell you. Even though we had the agreement when I started with him that he would see me if needed when I needed the attention. Example: if I needed to get a shot of Toradol/Phenergen. That has not been the case thus far. He says he's too busy to see me like today. So.. I called my other neurologists and asked them what I shoud do. I don't want to put any red flags up, but I need some releif. I tried to get in their office, but my other Dr. is stuck in Ireland with no way home. All the Dr.'s covering for him are swamped they said. They did want to try me on something new though. They called in a Medrol pack. You take it for 5 days in a row and it is a steroid. Then they suggessted that I stay on the Vicodin for the pain. I just want some releif. I feel as though I am being considered an abuser from some of the posts. That's not the case honest. Maybe I'm scared of the pain. Scared of missing more work and being out of commission and the pounding migraine. Just feel as If I am going insane with the pain I am having. The Percocet actually made me smile some the past few days. They dulled the pain beyond beleif.. I am calling the other Dr. who won't see me due to his busy schedule right now and canceling my appointment on Friday. I won't see him any longer if that is the conditions. I will see the Dr. who took the time to be somewhat caring about the situation. Which was my original Dr. I don't want a red Flag to go up and mostly I don't want people here or anywhere else to think I am an abuser.. That's the feeling I am getting..
	Top

	Christa	Sep-17-01, 01:04 PM (CMT)
	7. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	Paula: I DON'T consider you or anyone else on this board an "abuser" I would not make that judgement about anyone. I DO know however that we are all in a very fragile position with our doctors and are dependant on them to give us the meds we so desperately need. That can be very easy for some and much harder for others. It depends on the doctor. Obviously yours are a bit tight fisted with the narcotics if they are only giving you twenty at a time with no refills so you have to either find one who is a bit more open minded or be careful not to get in trouble with this doctor. Trust me I totally understand your situation and your dilemma. I don't want you to think that I think you are an abuser. Only you can make that judgement on yourself anyway. As for the Medrol I think you should give it a shot. I just tried a 10 day cycle recently and it gave me 10 great days of NO PAIN! It was wonderful. If I were to abuse any medication it would be this, LOL. I felt like Superwoman, I got so much done. You are in enough pain right now without beating yourself up about using medication. Like I said before there are some things going on with your situation that are not ideal. Like having to get meds from other people or more than one doctor... BUT, that to me signals that you are undermedicated.
		Top

	Jenny	Sep-17-01, 01:28 PM (CMT)
	8. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	Paula, Yes! Try the Medrol dose pack. I was given one a few years ago for a back problem, and my head was crystal clear for the days I was on it. One trick (and the doctor told me this, so I know it's safe) is to take ALL of the first day's doses at once. It says in the directions that if you get the meds late in the day to just take them all at once. This sends a whammy of steroids to the inflamed areas (and a big part of migraines can be inflammation), but only do that on the first day. Take the rest as directed. This isn't a long term cure, but it can help for a few days. When I told my neurologist about how much the Medrol helped he just shook his head and said they could probably cure migraines if they could come up with a steriod that didn't have such horrific long term side effects. I definitely wouldn't give the stingy doctor another dime of my money, especially if he had given you the impression that he'd see you if you needed injections. With the pain as bad as you've had for as long as you've had it, he should have recommended that if nothing else, and it wouldn't have taken any time from his schedule, since the nurses usually give those, anyway. And again, none of us are going to accuse you of abusing. It's called pain management, and as you'll see when you read these posts, you either find a way to manage the pain, or you start toying with the idea of the ultimate cure. Maintaining quality of life is what we're all after here, and if it means taking pain meds on a regular basis, give me the meds!
		Top

PWallar	Sep-17-01, 02:30 PM (CMT)
9. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
Thanks Jenny and Christa for making me feel better. I just feel at times it's a lost cause. My hubby doesn't beleive in meds, so when I tell him they want me to try something else, or I can't stand the pain any longer and I need relief, he just kind of sighs. It's a tough situation to be in. I guess I should just call that Doc and tell him I need to see a Dr. then and I cannot tolerate a Do. who is just too busy. I've heard this from my family Doc and now this neurologists. It really stinks. I appreciate your e-amils back and input.. Paula
	Top

	heavyhead	Sep-18-01, 12:05 PM (CMT)
	10. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	PWallar, It looks like we are going thru a similar thing at the moment. I just got my script filled (20 Vicodin) on Friday. I have had a headache since last tuesday the 11th. It keeps coming back!! Yesterday, it got me early in the morning. I took one pill. An hour later I was in more pain. I figure ok...I am going to need to take another. It got to the point where my head was spliting open!! At this point.....I was incapacitated. A 3rd pill was taken, the rest of the day was a waste!! I was still in pain and laying down til bedtime. I had called the doctor during this for advise. I told them the meds were doing NOTHING. All they said was that I was on a VERY strong narcotic drug and they couldnt do anything else for me. I asked if there was something they could prescribe me 1 of, so I could get thru the day and not wind up in Urgent care like last Tuesday. All they did was set up an appointment for me to see the Nurse on Friday. I'm sure all she will do is give me a script for something that is too expensive (amerge..$117 for 10 pills) When I went to Urgent care, they gave me 15mg of hydrocodone. It worked. At home, I can NOT afford to take this much at once since it is 1/5 of the medicine I get for a several month period. Since Friday I have taken 6 of my pills already. I am almost half way thru my 2-3 month supply. I feel like shooting myself I dont know what to do anymore hh
		Top

	Christa	Sep-18-01, 12:33 PM (CMT)
	11. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	Vicodin (hydrocodone) does nothing for me except give me horrible rebounds. Percocet works a bit better but still gives me rebounds. I have the best luck with Fiorinal WITH codeine and my doctor does not give me a problem with giving me adequate quantities. 20 pills is ridiculous! The only thing my doctor has ever said about quantity is call if I use more than 24 pills in 3 days so he can instruct on a taper down and he is aware I am having a mig flare up.
		Top

	mishkyn	Sep-18-01, 02:04 PM (CMT)
	12. "RE: Percocet use-abuse-I need your advice!!"
	Dear Paula-- Of course you are not an addict. You are like most of us here--not receiving proper treatment/medication for the pain you are suffering. I built up quick tolerances to every narcotic I have ever been given. That's why I usually do not take them. With daily pain, how to pick the 2 days a week to get help? And nothing I have ever been given has been strong enough to do more than just blunt the pain. I was given percocet, and told to try it daily. After 4 or 5 pills/day, by the 5th day I could have taken the entire bottle and would have received no help. Short term opioids create too many peaks and valleys in the way they treat pain, and that is what is deadly to the headache patient. Also, the tylenol is very toxic to our systems. Doctors say we can take 4000 mg/day, one brand name site says only 2000mg, Richard's dr told him 1000. Just read in a magazine that taking one tylenol/day for a year--extra strength or not--can increase the chances of liver and/or kidney problems by 300%, and the chances of stomach ulcers by 400%. Add to that being stuffed full of drugs that do nothing to help our pain except maybe (big maybe) in the short term, and have horrid side affects. Good luck, Paula. I always enjoy your posts, you are so honest and so willing to let it all out, that you have helped me and many others, I'm sure. Mishkyn
		Top

Remove

Lobby | Topics | Previous Topic | Next Topic

Select another forum Lobby Migraine Discussion (Conference)   |--Migraine Discussion (Protected)   |--Migraines in Children (Protected)   |--Miscellaneous (Protected)   |--Migriane Petition (Protected)   |--Where are we? (Protected)   |--Photo Album (Protected)

Please help this site run smoothly by reading and and following the rules.

DISCLAIMER: This website is intended to provide a forum for the free exchange of information only. The maintainer of this site (Ronda Solberg) in no way sponsors, supports or condones any of the advice given herein, nor supports the use of any medication, supplement, herb, substance or program, except pursuant to a licensed medical practitioner's care. In no way does the maintainer of this site advocate the use of any illegal medication, herb, supplement or other substance or the importation, distribution or sale thereof. Persons who have any question about the legality of any action that they are planning to take are advised to consult an attorney.

The views and opinions of posters to this web site do not necessarily state or reflect the opinion of this site's maintainer. Likewise, the maintainer of this site will not be held responsible for the availability or content of the sites linked to by this site, nor warrants or guarantees the information described or offered at these sites. Furthermore, migrainepage.com nor the maintainer of migrainepage.com does not warrant or assume any legal liability or responsibility for the accuracy, completeness, or usefulness of any information, apparatus, product, medicine, or process mentioned on this web site.