Hi, I am a first time poster. I have a condition called pseudotumor cerebri, which translates to a problem with my brain creating cerebro spinal fluid, but not reabsorbing it as fast as it's created, so I have an excess that creates pressure, and causes all of the symptoms of having a brain tumor without the actual cellular mass, and without the condition causing death. What it does cause, among many other things, are visual impairment and very bad headaches on a daily basis, that range from just headaches, to black out migraines. In the past couple of months, I have started having migraines that set in suddenly, that hurt more than I ever imagine a headache could and a person survive,I will collapse, the pain willlast as long as a couple of hours, or as little as a minute, then subside, and I will be worn out for days with lesser bursts of pain following, and extreme emotions such as crying, rage, laughing for no real reason. I realise I am probably in the wrong forum, but have any of you ever experience migraines like this? Or are there any other PTC people here? If so, do you have any suggestions? I have had this about nine years, and it has gotten progressively worse, these most severe migraines being most recent- about three months now. Generally, PTC is treated with medication I can't take, spinal taps that are painful and don't last for me, and usually resolves itself or goes away after a short while, so my case is not a standard case. I am seeing doctors, but none of them have figured out what to do. I am supposed to be getting an appointment to be evaluated for a shunt, soon, but untill then, I need to do something to deal with the pain, preferably something besides sleep twenty four hours a day.

Olivia Monteith <fuhqtoo@cableone.net>
Thursday, April 3, 2003 at 15:45:13

Hello,
I am so glad I found this site!!! Yesterday I got a migriane the size of Texas..I should have suspected it was coming on since the night before I had an aura...which freaked me out!!! I popped a couple of fiorinols but they did nothing. I had a new prescription of Zomig which I kept eyeing but was scared to take becuase I haven't had much luck with such meds (IE: Imitrex). Last night I suffered the worst I have in many months. So this morning I broke down and took the Zomig...30 min later my migriane was masked(gone)!!! I am getting ready to take the second one to keep it from coming back!! I have NEVER been able to get rid of a migriane like that! I have tried just about every migriane drug and prescription pain pills out there and finally I think I have found one!!! ZOMIG is my savior...lets just hope this isn't a one time fix. Wish me luck!!

Geni from Maryland
Thursday, April 3, 2003 at 07:19:49

Hi everyone, well I first visited this website about 2-3 weeks ago & I fully understand what you are all going through.

By the way, Bonnie - I saw your entry that you posted earlier looking for my e-mail add. - well now you have it again.


I attended a new migraine clinic in Dublin (in the Beaumont Hospital) & the doctor eventually prescribed 'amitriptyline' a 25mg dose (tablet) that I have to take every night - this will make me drowsie which is good as it will help me sleep better. I have to take it for 4 months & then return for another appointment. What I'm asking anyone who is reading this - if any of you have been prescribed this as I know it is an antidepressant & if so has it helped you in any way.

Would appreciate your comments.

Regards
Lisa

Lisa <dooballa77@hotmail.com>
Saturday, March 29, 2003 at 12:57:21

I was reading the entries and noticed a posting by Jennifer on the 20th of this month. I would like to be able to e mail her since we are going through very similar situations. If Jennifer reads this, could you please e mail me? Thanks!! Everyone be as pain free as you can and take care!

Bonnie Allen <TheBelle1@aol.com>
Friday, March 28, 2003 at 12:40:54

Hey everyone! I have not posted in a while (I kept getting an error message), but I am here to try again! I did the Botox treatment in Feb 2003 and it did a little help, but the doctor said that I could need up to three treatments to get a really positive result. I have been on disability for over 2 years now and had high hopes for the botox. However, I found out when I went back for my monthly appt in March that Blue Cross/Blue Shield will NO LONGER cover any botox treatments, including the ones for chronic pain. I think this is sooo wrong because I know alot of people that it has helped! And who can afford the treatments on their own? It was over $1200 for the one I did have. I am appealing the decision and hope that anyone else who has this insurance lets them know that this is not acceptable or fair to pain patients!

Also, I was writing with a girl in Ireland named Lisa that I met on this site, and her address is no longer valid. If you read this, Lisa, please give me an e mail! Thanks!

Everyone be as pain free as you can, and remember we are migraine survivors, not sufferers....for we have tremendous strength to live with what we do!

Bonnie <TheBelle1@aol.com>
Friday, March 28, 2003 at 11:58:05

I counted up, yesterday, the number of times I've had to take
Amerge or Zomig since 8-10-02. Twenty. 20!!!!!!!! Thats down from 5-7x's a week for the previous 4 years and 3-5x's a week since 1986. The only difference is this Mannatech stuff I take
(food) 2x's a day. A "PLUS" tablet and 75% of a teaspoon of
"Ambrotose" (whatever that is-food of sdome sort).

I read some of the recent posts and my heart is filled w pity
as I read about the suffering the folks on theis list are
undergoing. Been there, done that. BUT, not any more.

www.mannatech.com

G God the Father's
R Riches
A At
C Christ the Son's
E Expense-

lew

Lew <ljohn_97123@yahoo.com>
Friday, March 28, 2003 at 05:36:59

Hello Friends, I have not posted in a while but have been reading every post. I am in real mess now. I do not have a doctor so I have no Stadol NS. My doctor died and the new guy would not perscribe any for me. His reason was he does not use stadol in his practice. My hubby and I travel all over just to find a doctor who will help. I am on medicaid so many will not see me. I am about to lose my house and have to live in our old motor home. I know that stress is not helping my migraines. I will travel up to 4 hours away to go to an ER if I have too. I fell bad for my hubby but I don't know what to do anymore. The doctors here will not treat me so I have to do what I can do. I am going to try to get a new doctor soon. Wish me luck and I hope all are feeling well today.


Tay Hodges

Tay Hodges <tayhodges59@hotmail.com>
Thursday, March 27, 2003 at 15:04:44

It's really nice to see how many people there are who know what each of us are going through. I'm a pre-med student, I've been suffering from migraines since I was like 10 years old. Midrin helped back then, I didnt get them too often, but when I did, it just got rid of everything. But now Im all grown up, I have Mitral Valve Prolapse, JRA and just got rid of an Ulcer I had a few years back (probably from my ex). It is sooo hard finding a doctor who understands. One doctor only gets a "migraine" about once a year and takes imitrex and it goes away, so of course that makes her an expert. I'm already on a beta blocker for my MVP and when I do get a migraine, I take T3 w/codiene (and I JUST found a doctor who realizes that I'm taking it for a justified reason instead of thinking I'm some sort of junkie!) For me, T3 doesnt give me a "high", it just gets rid of the pain...I'm happy for that.

I found that I have 2 types of migraines. A sinus migraine when a Low front moves through, I can only take Vicodin for that. And all the rest I take T3 (stress, hormones, food triggers etc..) I also have a sneaky suspicion that the reason I cannot fly (IMMENSE pain in the top of my head, located somewhere deap in the middle of the skull) is due to my migraines. I have had all the tests to make sure that it is not anything else like a tumor. Last time I flew, I basically ended up dead, or very close to what that feels like. Pain beyond words, nausea and deafness for about 24 hours. I am VERY sensitive to Pressure changes! Has anything like this happened with anyone else?
I'm sorry this is so long! I've also been noticing that lately, when I do go a day without taking my T3 with codiene, theres like a slight burning sensation around my sinus areas (eyes, brows, etc) But I refuse to take meds if I don't have a migraine! Any suggestions on that one?
Oh, in case someone needs a combo that might help, my sister takes midrin and vicodin together for her pain, she says it helps...
Thanks for listening all, Hope today is migraine free!

Tammyk <tams_k@yahoo.com>
Monday, March 24, 2003 at 15:51:19

Dear Journal.

I am a 17 year old girl and I have suffered from maigrained since I was younger than 3, 3 is the age I first went to the doctors, they tested me for epilepsy as that was what they assumed I had- I would blank out and be unreachadble till the initial phase was gone. Now its worse, I am on Paramax but it doesnt seem to be helping that much, the pain it helps, but I also get an all over panicky feeling if I take it when I know one is coming on. I feel alone because I cant explain the way I feel to anyone and I feel abit mad when I'm crying in front of my boyfriend and I cant explain why. If anyone out there has the same symptoms as me please email me and let me know

Tingling in my hand, paralysed limbs
eyes rolling into my head and I cant stop them
Slurred speech
Dreamy feeling that comes on during the day even when I'm not even expecting a maigraine
loss of hearing
loss of breath
emotional
panicky feeling
feverish
twitching in my hands
tingling and numbness in my hands and tongue, face

I hate the feelings, I am trying so hard not to let it affect my life but its had when you have just gotten a new job tutoring and half the time I dont even feel like I am there, and when I do I am constantly thinking about "when will it happen next"
It's affecting every aspect of my life, the doctor has told me that another common symptom is not being able to feel a whole side of your body!!
I am scared and feel alone, nobody seems to understand, please get in touch if you do....
alex_w@xtra.co.nz
Thank You..

Alex <alex_w@xtra.co.nz>
Sunday, March 23, 2003 at 13:00:45

Wow, my husband just found this website and reading everyone's entries has caused me to cry in sympathy and relief. Relief not from the pain but from the knowledge that i am not alone afterall. i have been suffering from migraines since gradeschool. i am now 36 years old. they were infrequent though severe up until highschool but then i just took over the counter medication daily. in my early twenties they took a turn for the worse but i continued to fight them on my own with over the counter meds and sleep. in my mid twenties they got so bad that i started to see a specialist. he was wonderful. he told me that i wasn't crazy or a wimp that couldn't handle pain. his wife suffered from them horribly so he was a unique understanding doctor. he is known nationally and speaks at many conferences. any doctor that i had seen previously told me they were stress and that i brought them on myself. this new doctor gave me immitrex when it was brand new and only in injection form. at first it was my salvation. i had a life again. he was also trying to find a preventative for me as i had attacks at least 3 times a week. i would go through 2 boxes (4 shots) in a week. for 8 years i worked with this dr and the only thing that happened was that my migraines became worse and more frequent. i then moved to a place 3 hours from him and only saw him occaisionaly. he finally told me after all this that he didn't know what else to do. i had to see a dr. in my new town to get my prescriptions and they all thought that i had rebound h/a's. one dr. even thought that i was trying to defraud him when i asked for refills of percocet. at that time, percocet was the only pain killer i used. i had to go to the er at leat once or twice a week for over a year. i had to quit work because i was unreliable as i missed too many days. i was told that i was rebounding from the er shots so they restricted them to once a week and i got better. this is when i was able to go back to work and so i moved to get a job with the state. thinking they would be more understanding of a disability. this is how i came to move up here. i had been in the hospital over 10 times with migraines treated with dhe. one stay in the hospital was 12 days long. they knocked me out for what was supposed to be 8 hours and i woke up 3 hours later and still had the pain. after seeing several neurologists in my new town, they told me they weren't comfortable with my "program" so they sent me to a gp who had a lot of patients that had reached the end of the line. i told him about everything i had been through. the uncountable medications that had been tried as a preventative, the hospital stays, the mri's etc. he was very kind and listened to everything i said. he didn't have any new ideas but he seemed at least to believe that they weren't rebounds and that i wasn't looking for drugs. a few months later, i was admitted to the hospital with a terrible pain in my stomach and bleeding from the rectum. i had also been diagnosed with irritable bowel and my stomach attacks had also gotten worse and worse until this attack that sent me to the hospital. i had a colonoscopy and they found that my colon had been severly damaged. the skin had been sloughed off in many places and was bleeding raw. they determined that IMMITREX was the cause. i was going through 2 packages of tablets and 4 boxes of shots a month. so i am telling people that they need to be careful about immitrex and how much they take. it kept me functional for so long and my specialist had told me they were safer than ibuprofen or tylenol. after that i couldn't take immitrex any more. i tried once because the pain was so bad i couldn't take it. when i took the immetrex i had a reaction that i had never had before. my throat, lips and tongue went numb. dr said i could never take it again. thus began the narcotic nightmare. all i can take for pain now is narcotics. i take three different kinds so that i don't get rebounds. all that is happening is that i am building a tolerance to them and we have to keep increasing the dose. no one know what else to do. i am missing more and more work again and am in danger of losing my job. i layed down at work a few times with an icepack when i was near passing out or throwing up and now they have accused me of sleeping on the job. the stress of possibly being fired is making the pain worse. i have been in constant pain every day for years. so long now that i often wish for death. i have tried everything that is out there to no avail. i have down biofeedback, accupuncture, massage therapy and the botox injections. nothing has worked and it is ruining my life. luckily i have a wonderful supportive husband because without him i don't think i would be here now. he used to get migraines really bad as a child so he understands. but i am worthless now. i am a terrible wife. he does everything around the house because i am either in too much pain or am wiped out from the pain. i have no social life and barely have a job. i wish these entries were required reading for anyone that employs a migraine sufferer because as we all know. they dont understand. i am sorry that this is so long winded and somewhat unorganized. i was just going to write about the immitrex for now so that others don't end up with the same problem but all of a sudden everything just came pouring out. this disease is not fatal but it is life threatening. people like us have no life at all. i just wish more time and money would be spent on researching the cause of migraines. not just rescue treatment. i also have to say that products like advil and excedrin, etc who claim to be migraine medications were forced to withdraw their claims. excedrin in particular is the worst. all they did was put the word migraine on their package. it is the same medication that they have always been. there is no difference between excedrin and excedrein migraine!!!!!! i will shut up now because i am reaching my anger zone and that doesn't do anyone any good. i just hope that hearing part of my story can help someone else know that they are not alone. this disease is very isolating and depressing.

Melissa <hermannme@uwstout.edu>
Saturday, March 22, 2003 at 13:12:56

I've just visited Barry Spencer's page which hypothesizes caffeine intake/withdrawal MAY be the cause of ALL migraines. How many of you consume caffeine or caffeine containing products? Visit his site if you aren't sure what foods, medicines, etc. are suspect. The address is :www.batnet.com/spencer/
My short history is: I am a coffee drinker for many years yet I only began experiencing migraines two years ago.(You will see on his site that migraines are NOT caused by food allergies.) I ALWAYS have an aura preceding the headaches(including floaters, flashing colors, sensitivity to light- from the sun to headlights at night, a queasy stomach -no vomiting- & lastly, I've recently begun experiencing confusion in organizing my thoughts.) They started out very mild & infrequently- maybe one every month with no obvious pattern- to the day before menstruation & besides, to 1-3 days in a row with intense pain. They also come at different times of the day & night regardless of whether I'm still drinking a cup of coffee or haven't had anything containing caffeine for a few hours. The only times I've had shorter than usual auras are when I've taken Frova & then was able to experience the worst & longest headaches of my life. I've yet to take the Imitrex which I've just been prescribed. Waiting for the next episode...
The point/question is; Does anyone think this theory is a little off the mark? It definitely makes for some interesting reading & I think it may help a lot of people BUT to categorize ALL migraines as possibly- no, he doesn't state definitively- related to the effects of caffeine overdose or withdrawal seems to be misleading & would promote further misunderstanding between sufferers & non-sufferers.
Admittedly I am still a coffee drinker so I would like to know what anyone else who reads this board thinks about this theory, especially people who've abstained from caffeine for whatever reasons, as well as coffee drinkers like myself.
Well, thanks for your time & feedback is welcome. Stay strong!

Deanne <Lotuspetal10@aol.com>
Saturday, March 22, 2003 at 11:47:28

I am 35 years old and have had migraines since 14 or so. and they've been a constant visitor in my life since. The first time I got one I thought I was dying. Right side of the head pounding severely in the temple, couldn't stand light, sound, motion, would vomit. Right eye would tear and water down my face, and my right nostril would congest completely closed, sometimes both nostrils.

It has been years of torture pretty much. I always get at least one killer migraine at the beginning of my period, and several in between periods as well. In other words, I get them for several reasons. Hormonal, Rain (barometric pressure drop), alchohol (especially red wine), chocolate, onions, sometimes graps and citrus fruits. sometimes I have no idea why.

I almost always get my migraines in the middle of the night. At 3 or 4 in the morning, and it's already in full swing. I tried Imitrex and it did nothing. I believe I tried Fiornal with no results as well (can't remember the name). The only thing that works for me is Zomig.

Lately I've been getting very frequent migraines and dizziness. Sometimes every night for a week. It has been causing me to use way too much Zomig and they wouldn't refill my prescription. (The FDA limits the amount you can take.) So I've asked to be put on a preventative, and they gave me Inderal. I'm starting that tonight and hope it works. I did try Elavil last year and it made me feel worse, and sleepy and just plain weird.

By the way, I have a 3.5 year old daughter and wonder if hormones caused my migraines to get worse after child birth. I also pray to God I haven't passed on this horrible disease to her..

Interestingly, I don't know anyone in my family with migraines, but my grandmother and uncle had mental illness, one of my 3 brothers is bipolar, another brother has depression and is on prozac, and another brother has some rare condition that causes him to have extremely low blood pressure when the brain is supposed to signal to raise his blood pressure(makes him pass out). It happened on the soccer field. They wanted to put him on a beta blocker, but he wouldn't because it would affect his physical ability. If you notice, all 3 brothers have ailments related to brain chemistry. Just like me and my migraines.

Well, Thanks for listening and for this great website. Misery loves company.

Jennifer
Thursday, March 20, 2003 at 16:25:26

I have had Migraines for about 11 years now. This was different though, I have had the same headache for about 5 months now...after several visits to my GP and many medications later I was finally referred to a specialist. I was in to see a Neurologist last week and found out some very interesting information. I was told that I had what is called a Transition Migraine which is infact cause by the pain killers used to treat Migraines. I was told that I had to stop taking the pain killers or the head ache would continue. That was Thursday and I can honestly say that I am feeling at least 75% better if not more. The headache is still there but each day it seems to get better...I seem to have more energy too. I just thought I would share this incase any of you are in a similar situation.

I found this some what frustrating as well because I was only doing and taking the medication that my doctor had told me to take...no more than that.

I haven't been able to find anything on the Internet regarding Transition Migraines...if anyone is familiar with this please email me.

Thanks,
Megan

Megan Hurl <mpvhurl@shaw.ca>
Wednesday, March 19, 2003 at 09:29:25

My boyfriend found this site one night and bookmarked it for me and I've only just got round to viewing it. After reading everyone's stories I have been left in tears, as quite frankly, I thought I was the only person going through such a thing and cannot believe that this is happening to other people, who also cannot find and answer for it. I feel for you all and wish I could hug each and every one of you because I understand. I have suffered from migraines all my life (I'm now 20 years old) but was able to control them with certain medications until August 28th 2002. I was admitted to hospital with suspected Meningitis, because I had severe migraine, aversion to lights, vomiting etc. After three days in hospital and many tests including a CAT scan, which cam back normal, I was released, still suffering from a migraine with no explanation at all.I have had a headache/migraine (varying in strength from day to day) every day since that day which makes it almost seven months I have been suffering from god knows what. Every day I wake up and pray that it will be gone, yet every day it is still there. At the best of times,it eases off a little and I can get on with things I need to do, but at the worst of times I am left a shivering, crying wreck only moving to vomit until the pains in my stomach won't let me vomit anymore. Crying because I just want to die and I have no idea why this is happening to me or if it will ever stop.Having to live in darkness because the light feels like someone stabbing me in the head and nothing seems to help at all.
I was booked to go back and see the doctor at the hospital as an out-patient a couple of weeks later and have seen him every 6-8 weeks since. He has tried various medications amytriptyline, Maxalt, Sumatriptan and Inderol to name a few, but with absolutely no success at all. He also sent me for an MRI scan which also came back normal and seems now to neither know or care what to do with me. I have also tried taking a herbal supplement called feverfew, but have seen no improvement from them. I recently saw a neurologist who prescribed a drug to try for two weeks, I can't recall the name of them, but they were some form of steroid, also if that didn't work (which it didn't) Pizotifen, which I am currently taking for three weeks increasing the dosage every week. If this doesn't work (I have seen no improvement yet and I have been taking it for nearly two weeks) He will prescribe Epilim, a drug that is used to treat epileptics, so I'll be keeping my fingers crossed in hope that something works. If you have taken any suggestions of drugs from this, I hope they will work for you and if anyone has any suggestions I would be truly grateful to hear from you.
I feel comforted in a way that other people are going through this and understand the pain and suffering it causes and are working together in hope to find some result.
I am unbelievably grateful every day that as depleted as my own strength is, my boyfriend Matthew is there to be strong for both of us. We had only been seeing each other for just over five months when this happened and he has stayed by my side and been my rock, and has endured almost as much pain as I have and I thank god every day that he is with me to make me smile and to give me back my will to live when the pain is too much. I love you Baby, and I always will.

Lindsay Jones <foxybones@hotmail.com>
Wednesday, March 19, 2003 at 04:38:33

I have more than one specific reason for writing this post. I think the information regarding my case history may be VERY valuable to many migraine sufferers. I am hoping that the feed-back that I get will be helpful in proving what my doctor has diagnosed as the primary cause for my migraines. I think that his diagnosis has "hit the nail on the head" and this may be the case with many of the people on this forum as well as other migraine sufferers that have had to be satisfied with some sort of treatment for the symptoms without getting any results in eliminating the CAUSE.

I started experiencing migraines on the weekend back in 1992. They got progressively worse as the years went on. I have been treated by family physicians, neurologists, chiropractors over the last 11 years. I am not going to take up space to give all the details pertaining to the pain and suffering involved niether the many medications that were prescribed and used for these symptoms. The migraines started to occur during the week and continued to increase in frequency.

With a ten year history to look back upon along with current frequency increase and obvious relative conditions, my family doctor was able to come to some conclusions that I was not totally aware of until it cost me my job.

I have been diagnosed with an "anxiety disorder". If I am put in a position that requires that I have to do something that I am "unfamiliar with" this will precipitate a migraine headache. These migraines are caused by stress but it is a SPECIFIC TYPE of stress, not just stress in general. For example; I have a fairly good singing voice and I was the song leader at our church for a few years. Even with the ability to sing I was always afraid that I was going to make some terrible blunder in front of the congregation and as a result I would most often experience a severe headache after church was over. This increased in frequency and I finally had to give the song leading up. This experience was not enough to make me aware of what was really going on concerning the cause for the migraines for the following reason.

I am a PGI (Pyrotechnics Guild International) certified Fireworks Display Operator and I also am a hobbyist shell builder. There is a tremendous amount of STRESS involved with being the primary person responsible for a large fireworks display. Just having to coordinate the many people involved with the actual firing of the display is very stressful let alone all the other safety factors to be considered. I have NEVER experienced a migraine headache as a result of shooting a fireworks show! This was the reason that I hadn't considered tress to be much of a factor.

I was employed at a metal fabrication shop as a certified welder from 1981 to May of 2002. In 1992 I was elected as "employee representative" (Cheif union steward. We had a contract agreement but no affiliation with an organized union.) I really didn't want this responsibility but a large percentage of the employees pleaded with me to do it because the new contract offer that the company had proposed was unacceptable and there was nobody else willing to "go to bat" for the employees. This is when the migraines started. After seeing several different doctors including a neuroligist who had me take an MRI, nobody had any answers. The neurologist said, "It's job stress. You're all wound up during the week and you relax on the weekend which causes the muscles around blood vessels in your head to relax allowing some sort of substance in the blood to pass through the vessel walls and irritate the muscles, thus causing the migraine headache."

The "9/11" tragedy caused a slowdown at my work place and I was required to learn other job responsibilities other than my regular obligations as their senior welder. I began to realize that the headaches would occur either during or shortly after I was "farmed out" to another machine or job function that I was unfamiliar with. This was the primary cause for the headaches that were happening during the week. Management was aware of the headaches and the appearant cause but I was willing to deal with it when it was necessary due to lack of work in the weld area. I did have to leave work on a few occassions because I could not focus mentally or visually due to the severity of the headaches. I stayed at work on many occassions while under the influence of prescribed narcotic pain relievers which would have been hard for the company to explain if an accident had happened.

On May 1, 2002, I was told that I had to cross train on several machines to satisfy a new "work cell" concept that was necessary to implement for the company to stay in business. I had several meetings with management to try to make them understand that this would cause my migraine problem to increase to the point that I would not be able tolerate, let alone be able to work. Some of these headaches had been severe enough to raise thoughts of suicide. I was not willing to suffer the imminent results of their mandate. I was terminated on May 6.2002. I lost everything that I had worked for for twenty years. I have not been able to find another job. I can say with confidence that I can weld. I am government certified in all aspects of the TIG and MIG weld processes but under the circumstances, employers are apprehensive about hiring me. I am presently trying to get justice through the Civil Rights Commission but the statutory description of a "disability" is not very clear in regards to my situation. I would like to do everything in my power change this because it is a REAL disability!

I am pleading for HELP! If anyone can relate to this problem with similar experience or can direct me to a source for similar case studies please reply to David at: dwapgi@hotmail.com or d.armstrong@mchsi.com

David Armstrong <dwapgi@hotmail.com>
Friday, March 7, 2003 at 15:37:48